I'm so f-ed. Laid off in June at 61

[TheGreatConspiracy]

I'm a veteran business editor and writer with PR experience.

When I got laid off in June, I was optimistic. LinkedIn showed me numerous jobs for which its algorithm said I would be a "top applicant." In many cases, I matched all the skills listed. Ho boy, howdy, was I naive.

I quickly found out that applying for 100 jobs I'm qualified for gets, maybe, one or two "phone screen" interviews, followed by ghosting. I got past that first phase just once. It's hard to determine how much of this is age discrimination.

Most of the time, I get either no response or an emailed message saying they are concentrating on people who are "a better fit." Never mind that I had all the listed credentials and experience. Other people got interviews for being a "better fit."

I'm also getting rejected for "jobs" that keep getting re-posted. Those, I suspect, are phony listings for positions that will never be filled. I'm told companies want to look like they're hiring, even when they aren't. So they post zombie jobs.

I have had professional help with my resume and cover letters. But it hasn't helped.

This is frustrating because it never occurred to me to retire before age 70 or 72. I like working. And I'm good at what I do.

It's frustrating to think my career might be over before I'm financially and mentally ready for it.

How does a seasoned pro get a shot in this market? I don't expect anyone to have a definitive answer. I certainly don't.

[Bluethroughu]

1. You are not alone.

My neighbor, also 61 got laid off from his job after a lifetime of well done productive in medical supplies.

He's not having much luck, and did not want to retire until 65.

[usonian]

2. Hiring is a disaster area, flooded with Chat-generated garbage.

Best I can suggest is to query your network. That seems to be the only way to break through the mess.

You might look for a job with a tech company. Take it from me, they really need writers, and ones with business experience.

I gave up on sites like LinkedIn long ago, when it just started to spiral into spam hell.

You might sign up with Hacker News ( https://news.ycombinator.com ). It is frequented by techies, and especially, VC types.

There is a link there for jobs at YC's startups.

And you can always post, asking who is hiring (I think)

The owner, Paul Graham is a VC.

Good Luck. Jobs dried up after I left my last startup and my network got me one consulting position.
I did get a high rating at a consulting company that farmed people out, but didn't exercise that option.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

5. What's a VC?

Thanks

[usonian]

7. Venture Capitalist

I lived in the SF Bay Area/Silicon Valley for 30 years, and that's all you hear about.

VC's flood startups with money "funding rounds" so hiring can be furious at times.

Firing, as well. All the big tech companies you see were startups at one point, and relied on venture capital.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

31. I was thinkomg Viet Cong. My take....

[usonian]

32. Also known as Vulture Capitalists.

It was sad to see Scott Adams go complete nutjob.
Sailed right off the edge of the old flat Earth.

[msongs]

10. mitt romney lol nt

[IbogaProject]

12. HN has monthly job threads

There are two every month. Who is hiring and who is looking are the two monthly threads. But yes you need to contact people you know to get past the computerized automated screening.

[usonian]

13. I'm retired and don't look there. Thanks.

😎

[IbogaProject]

14. I was adding to your idea

I was adding to help the thread author.

[usonian]

15. You bet! We try to help and other here. I took it positively.

[usonian]

16. sorry. Duplicate post.

Network delays are mesfing up my posts. Sigh.

[Turbineguy]

3. I'm 73 and work part-time as a community college teacher.

It's a pretty sweet deal, does some public good and keeps my brain active.

[megahertz]

4. Maybe apply to a government entity. They're typically more open to older workers.

Meaning city, county, state, and federal government. Also state/public universities.

Good luck.

[jimfields33]

27. And you only need 5 years to get a pension over a certain

age. It won’t be huge but with a federal government pension, SS and savings, this person may be just fine.

[3Hotdogs]

6. I agree that the "Linked-in" and one or two similar are a waste of your time.

A job get posted. ..Several hundred responses in reply. What does anyone think the chance of any of those getting read might be?

I wish I had a solution for you. All I know is that once in a while, someone on D.U. posts about getting a position after months and even years of trying.

[Metaphorical]

8. I feel your pain

A year ago, I was laid off from a job as manager of technical documentation for a company, about the time that AI was just beginning to make serious I ended up in the hospital for COPD about six months after that, again after doing exactly what you're doing. The job market, especially for writers, is seriously FU'd.

After I got out of the hospital, at the age of 60, I threw everything job related in the trash, then spent about a week working out a strategy for what I needed to do. In my particular case:

1. I acknowledged that no one today was going to hire a sixty year old man, especially in the world of tech, unless they were senior management. I had been a consultant for most of my life, which also pretty much meant that this particular track was not going to happen either. This was a hard admission to make, but it was necessary because it meant that I should stop putting effort into strategies that weren't working.
2. Assess where you have a voice. I have been blogging regularly since the early 2000s, and have worked as a journalist and editor at various points. Neither pays terribly well, mind you, because publishers are dying, but it did mean that I've managed to build up a reputation in a few key tech spaces.
3.Build out that network. I started newsletters, and made a real push to publish at least two online newsletter posts a week, on Linked In. I've since branched out to other places, but I now have a newsletter with 10,000 subscribers.
4. Set up a podcast or webcast and stick to it. I usually try to do at least one of those a month, typically alternating between interviews and explainers. If you're not familiar with video and audio broadcasting, get familiar.
5. Set up a calendly account, and promote it as a way to let other people get on your schedule - I usually have a free coffee hour where I let others set up a zoom or google meet meeting, and this has opened up a lot of other opportunities.
6. Treat yourself as a business. If you're a writer, write books. if you're an essayist, write collections. If you're a novelist, write novels. I do all three.
7. Be patient. It took me about a year for everything to finally work on all cylinders, and while money is still tight, I'm making around $75K a year as my own business, and should be making north of $120k a year once some final projects ramp up.

I'm now getting to the point where I'm turning down office work because I would be taking a pay cut, and would likely end up doing nothing but arguing with the CEO of the company. I other words, once you got independent, you'll find it's a one way trip. Is it worth it? Most of the time.

One more point. LinkedIn is not a place to find a job. It's a place to promote yourself. These are different things.

[MotownPgh]

9. Wonderful advice.

As an ex editor/tech writer, I can tell you that AI is taking those jobs for sure.

[slightlv]

21. I managed to hang in until I was 62

by arguing with everyone that I didn't need to quit work because of my disability, I just needed to have at least 2 days remote work towards the end of the week to recover from the first of the week. I have fibro and lupus and a back so screwed up the docs won't even do anymore surgery on it. I've had one hip replaced, and the other is needing it soon.

I wasn't ready to quit, either. I loved my job. I took administered our Sharepoint site, our network drive, and made Word into Web speak for Blackboard. Also created tests, etc... just about anything you could do with Blackboard, I did it and taught it to other departments. I managed 8 courses within DoD Army colleges (multiple colleges). The template I created allowed us to get ALL courses, including both distance learning, distance learning facilitated, and local courses back online with a morning's worth of work; the template is still used today.

I wrote an SOP for my position, concentrating only on the distance learning and facilitate distance learning. Most weekends saw me working at home (many times on my own dime). And, whether I worked at home or at the office, I was always and only on WiFi. IOW, there was no reason my "butt" had to be in a seat (as one dept manager told me). In fact, the work faster and more efficiently when I was working on my own high speed internet system.

But when my direct supervisor retired, the guy who moved up to take his place didn't like "confrontation" and would stand up for his people (at least, not un females). The department manager was so old school, he believed anyone working remote was screwing off, no matter how they recorded their time, had their camera on the whole time, etc. The real kicker -- less that a year and a half after I retired, everyonewas working remote because of Covid!

At least I had enough time in grade I could retire from the DoD with a (very) small annuity, and because I was 62, I could start Social Security early. Didn't come anywhere near what I was making, of course. But we figured as long as we could pay the bills and keep ourselves and the cats in food, we were good.

I passed on a bigger SS check now, figuring I'd probably at last that amount of money, anyway. With their actuaries, I figure it'd all even out in the end. It was a gamble, but one that I really didn't have a choice with.

I've looked for a job, and like you, I get a lot of initial attention but then nothing. One of the ones where I DID get more attention turned out to be a scam, so watch out for those. It so disheartened me, I basically stopped looking at the online job selections, mainly because the one I knew WAS a scam was never taken down, even after I informed the company hosting it. It just seemed to be the whole thing was a scam at that point.

My hubby's growing older (in all ways) faster than me, so a good portion of my time is either taking care of him or getting us out of messes he's unwittingly put us in. This last one was an "FBI" gift card scam and cleaned out our checking and savings. So, I've got my hands full enough here at home right now! ;0

I'd still like to work, tho... especially in the world of online learning... before the technology gets too far ahead of where it was when I quit. Blackboard is even going AI, which is going to be interesting in checking for cheating in essays, etc., IMO. I do try to keep up, just in case. Once I get our finances straightened out again, my next "project" is redoing my website. I love the design I created for it, but it's not easily translatable to smaller devices like a phone. So, it needs to be upgraded. But it's a huge site because it's a resource site. So that should keep me busy for quite a while, in and of itself! I do think I'll keep this current version in a separate directory on the webhost, just to show it off when I want. Meanwhile, life goes on... and I always have the task of piles of cat hair to clean up around the floors! (LOL)

Good luck to you! I love the ideas of making your own business. I'm a candelar, and have been thinking of doing the craft shows around town. Beginning to teach myself how to make soaps and lotions, as well. I used to do the starving artists shows back in the day and absolutely loved them! In fact, I financed a good portion of divorce with my craftwork back then! You just never know what ideas you'll come up with!

My biggest advice, based on troubles I have in my own life, is to set a schedule for yourself and try to adhere to something akin to a routine. My disability sometimes doesn't let me, but I do try as often as I can. When I do it, my whole self feels much better! Good luck!

[iemanja]

11. Do you put dates in your resume?

Don’t. It makes it easier for employers to practice age discrimination.

I’m sorry about what you’re going through. It must be very disheartening.

[AverageOldGuy]

17. Age

My daughter is 56. She is an attorney in a white shoe DC firm and she has an unblemished record as a litigator -- a trial lawyer.

Her supervisor is a partner with the brains of a goose.

Daughter is looking for a job at another firm but no matter what she does , she gets no invites for interviews. It's all about age.

[DFW]

24. My younger daughter is an attorney as well

She graduated law school in New York in 2010 at age 25, right at the end of the Cheney-Bush recession. She wanted to work in Boston, New York or Washington DC. She graduated magna, but from a “second tier” law school. She couldn’t even get an interview.

So, she burned through some savings and flew to a legal job fair in Frankfurt. The Frankfurt branch of a British law firm showed some interest, but said they needed someone who was bilingual in English and German, had an EU work permit but an American bar exam. My daughter said, “here I am, that’s me on all counts.” So, she ditched her desire to work in the northeastern USA and moved to Frankfurt. The ironic ending is that two years after moving to Germany to work for the British firm, she was head-hunted by a New York firm for their Frankfurt office, did well, and became their youngest partner ever at age 31, and now makes many multiples of what I do.

It’s not enough any more just to be good at what you do. You have to be impossibly flexible, incredibly good at what you, amazingly convincing about how good you are, and lucky along the way. From the sound of it, it’s a brutal, unforgiving competition in the States these days, and in many fields. I went the opposite way decades ago, and built myself a fifty foot tall titanium wall of job security. That was nearly 50 years ago. The downside is that I’m now 72, stuck and can’t find a replacement. You’d think there would be someone out there with my job skills, work and residence permits for both the USA and the EU, and written/spoken English, German, French, Russian, Spanish, Dutch, Italian and at least one Scandinavian language. But apparently not☹️

[jmbar2]

18. Being a substitute can help while you're in survival mode

I became a substitute teacher 3 years ago to help with the rising cost of living. Age has not been a factor, but it can be strenuous subbing for elementary grades.

My favorite is subbing for high school special ed. Generally, you are assisting an experienced teacher and providing one-on-one support. Doesn't pay particularly well, but you can choose your work days, there aren't many barriers, and it is rewarding.

Good luck.

[LuvLoogie]

19. What is something you've always wanted to do or try,

but never had the time for? Would you consider a job unrelated to your profession? Something you could do until you retire. Of course you may have income requirements that your job provided, but might be hard to find or gain in a new field. But you could try something that uses some of your skill set and some of your untapped aptitude. Maybe a job at costco or starbucks while you look for a career related job.

Another thing you might try if you have any social media chops, is to start a YouTube or TikTok channel, just to keep your writing up while you look. You could also try writer meetups in your area, just for further relationship building.

Sometimes just a chill neighborhood job you can walk to, can be fulfilling in a way you hadn't allowed for.

[Aussie105]

20. "A better fit" is code talk.

And it could mean discrimination on anything is being applied, gender, skin color, or age.

Most companies select not on skill set, but other factors - ones that are illegal to state out loud as they may be legally discriminatory.

Another one . . . 'does not meet the company's ethos'!

Local GP is female and Indian.
All the people who work there are . . . well, guess! Not hard to guess right. That 'ethos' thing at work.

Good luck job hunting!
And remember, your value of who you are as a human being isn't defined by the job you do.

[Stpaoulboy]

22. Keep the faith

I started a job just a little over 3 years ago at 56 and found out that "our" generation was valued for our work ethic. Maybe lean into your age a bit. Hoping for the best for you.

[hurple]

23. I got laid off onmy 51 birthday.

I got laid off, or told I would be laid off, on my 51 birthday from the biggest employer in this area. Now I am not gonna name names but what they did to their employees (laid off almost 5000 people) was not being a good neighbor, guess they needed the extra money to hire Jimmy Fallon for their stupid commercials. Thing is in this state, for my job classification, they had to give me 3 months notice and allow me to post for other jobs in the company. I tried for several but just missed one or two (one was given to somebody who had held the position before but had moved to a different department... so a fair cop.)

Anyway, my exact position was reposted about 3 months after I left. Apparently, moving it to a hub office did not work out like they thought it would. Now, this is a position I had for 20 years. I sent in my resume and got rejected out of hand so fast that I am sure nobody even looked at it.

From the paperwork that we received at termination it is absolutely clear the layoffs were age related. 75% or more of those terminated were 50+. They made us sign that we would not sue for age discrimination to get our severance, which was ... way over-generous. I got 3 years of my salary for mine.

So... now I am in a better position in a state agency with people who respect my skills far more than the other company, and I am even considered the entire state's SME on my particular specialty. All at double the pay of the previous job and union protection.

[snot]

25. Question: Although the info in the OP and replies fits my general impression in some ways,...

...I also have a clear general impression that some ways, older folks seem more competent* and have a better work ethic and "can do!" attitude than younger folks {remember "when it absolutely, positively must be there"?}; plus, to read the economic news in at least some quarters, competent, reliable employees are in short supply – so I'd been thinking this should be an era when older workers might have more, not fewer, opportunities.

*(At least, more articulate and capable of critical thinking. I've also had a very hard time finding competent plumbers, electricians, etc.)

**(Accustomed to working long hours and responding creatively to unexpected hurdles in order to make sure the goal is reached; as opposed, e.g., to just reading from a company script whether it fits or not, or insisting on working from home or more personal time, or even ghosting employers, which I understand to be more common among younger employees.)

***Note, I don't mean to blame younger workers; some of their modes of operation are doubtless due to their having observed how poorly employees have been treated by employers over the last couple of decades, so why should workers knock themselves out? Among other factors.)

SO, I'm interested in anyone's further observations about all this – do the attractions of competent, creative, workaholic Boomers really count for nothing in this market?

[SheltieLover]

28. Interesting questions!

I have a friend who manages a pharmacy & good grief, the nonsense they have to put up with younger workers (no offense to anyone intended*) would drive me crazy.

Not showing up or calling in once a week / walking out mid-shift without saying a word / showing up for work out of uniform, calling to say they decided to extend their vaca by 2 weeks at the last minute, etc., etc., etc.

I was shocked to learn such behaviors are fairly common -- at least in retail & yes, they could be written up & terminated, but replacements would likely not be any better.

* I agree with snot's post above, it could just be that younger workers see how employers use & abuse employees & they just don't care. No offense intended as this is a small group in one rather remote geographic region.

[snot]

33. Agreed; but fwiw, your report fits with what I hear from employers elsewhere.

[SheltieLover]

26. Try Virtual Vocations site?

There is a free trial, then a small monthly fee, but the jobs are supposed to be real & completely virtual.

Good luck!

[OAITW r.2.0]

29. I hope your situation improves. Still working at 71 (maybe 2 hrs a day), but I know our business is winding down.

Luckily, I waited until 70 to start collecting SS....my monthly check will take care of living expenses.

If I were in your situation today, I'd think about what you like to do and trying to see how you can monetize that interest.

[Americanme]

30. Good luck

I've been retired for one year. It's been a great year, did some traveling, we had time to work on our big old house. But, I decided to get a part time job, to supplement my income. I have never had trouble finding a job, always had good references, great reports from all my jobs. But I can't find a part time job now. I think it must be my age. They don't ask my age on the applications, but they see 43 years of work history listed, they know. I hope you find something soon, best of luck to you.