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Bettie

(19,528 posts)

147. Right? They see us as the enemy

Reply to c-rational (Reply #101)

Tue Feb 17, 2026, 02:07 PM

Feb 17

We refer to them as "our friends across the aisle"....but they aren't our friends.

They never have been.

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Scrivener7 AloeVera

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It is not an act of loyalty to quash conversations about our own party's role in getting to where we are today. [View all] Scrivener7 Feb 17 OP

Maybe that's why EarlG gave us The Way Forward forum. quaint Feb 17 #1

The posting rules are the same everywhere on DU EarlG Feb 17 #84

A concern is, snot Feb 17 #202

To answer your questions EarlG Feb 17 #209

Thank you; that all sounds good. snot Wednesday #238

Get a candidate who supports those things to run in a primary creeksneakers2 Wednesday #211

I did: snot Wednesday #237

Good creeksneakers2 Thursday #240

I try to be loyal to truth, beauty, what appears to me to be most constructive, snot Saturday #247

I didn't blame Bernie creeksneakers2 Sunday #248

It's a bit tricky... ._. Feb 17 #2

Yup, what Jason Crow said last week on TV gab13by13 Feb 17 #7

Sorry, it's not the Democratic Party. It's Republican voters, third party voters, and petulant nonvoters lapucelle Feb 17 #3

Kamala Harris won the election. gab13by13 Feb 17 #6

Yup, pedo Trump cheated on the vote count Farmer-Rick Feb 17 #30

That's a perfect way to keep losing iemanja Wednesday #213

This message was self-deleted by its author PeaceWave Wednesday #233

It's a perfect way to lose Farmer-Rick Thursday #242

Obviously Trump is trying to control the midterm vote iemanja Thursday #243

What??????????? Huh? Say what? Farmer-Rick Thursday #245

Yup! yellow dahlia Feb 17 #77

I'm noticing JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #9

I can count the leftists I've actually corresponded with online TBF Feb 17 #93

I can't do that JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #119

Can you "be in community" with Donald Trump? TBF Feb 17 #140

I disagree JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #145

What is "Magapub/CSA" - TBF Feb 17 #159

Magapub JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #163

I am old school labor - originally from Wisconsin TBF Feb 17 #179

And maga-pub IS NOT a political party---- it is a criminal domestic terrorist organization Jack Valentino Feb 17 #207

Thank you sir! JustAnotherGen Wednesday #222

This message was self-deleted by its author PeaceWave Feb 17 #166

Full Disclosure - I'm in NJ JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #149

This insists that any change must come from our opposition. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #36

I work hard, every single year, to elect Democrats in races big and small. lapucelle Feb 17 #45

I think we here all work hard to elect Democrats. And we have been doing so for years. And yet, here we are. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #48

Work harder to shut down opposition narratives, most especially those from purists and punishers lapucelle Feb 17 #52

Which, by definition, has nothing to do with shutting down discussions on DU. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #53

To begin with, expressing an opinion on a topic is not "shutting down discussion" on a topic. lapucelle Feb 17 #66

Really? Cirsium Feb 17 #92

That's an odd definition of "purist". lapucelle Feb 17 #99

Exactly Cirsium Feb 17 #117

Even given the definitional problems (and notwithstanding the random use of latin), lapucelle Feb 17 #127

hi back Cirsium Feb 17 #128

Recognizing a Latin word and saying your conclusion doesn't follow from your premises is not an argument either Ilikepurple Feb 17 #198

Creating your own three term argument by merging two distinct and seperate terms into one lapucelle Wednesday #221

You said even given the definitional problems, there conclusion does not follow Ilikepurple Wednesday #236

You merged two terms into one in an attempt to create a syllogism where none exists. lapucelle Wednesday #239

I didn't take that as an attack JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #180

agreed Cirsium Feb 17 #183

We shouldn't "shut down" speech Just_Vote_Dem Feb 17 #97

Couldn't agree more with you more Scrivener. choie Feb 17 #49

It's defining the mistakes JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #181

Personally... Chemical Bill Feb 17 #190

Yes! mcar Wednesday #234

I agree with you 100% Scrivener7. It is not a fluke that we are in this mess. flashman13 Feb 17 #71

I'm really looking forward to the primaries too. We have an incredible bench, and Scrivener7 Feb 17 #73

This message was self-deleted by its author PeaceWave Feb 17 #208

+1 leftstreet Feb 17 #103

Joe Biden WAS a great President. Chemical Bill Feb 17 #193

This message was self-deleted by its author PeaceWave Thursday #246

Well said. Thank you again! KPN Feb 17 #132

Isn't amazing that SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #40

Thanks for illustrating the problem. FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #65

The problem is Trump and republicans SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #75

I have never seen anyone here say that Democrats are the enemy FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #78

Good SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #88

And what Scrivener is asking is HOW did we get here? CrispyQ Feb 17 #100

We got here because of Republicans SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #110

So was it an attack or not? Ilikepurple Feb 17 #192

Have a nice day SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #194

What are you doing? Cirsium Feb 17 #94

Have a nice day! SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #98

With deliberate misrepresentation MorbidButterflyTat Feb 17 #109

Have a nice day! SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #111

Unrec. This is why we can't have nice things. TBF Feb 17 #112

It's the Democratic Party which nominates candidates which voters either accept or reject Jose Garcia Feb 17 #154

With the (somewhat) arguable exception of 2024, voters choose the candidates. lapucelle Feb 17 #165

Mahalo, lapucelle! Some seem to forget Cha Feb 17 #170

Thank you for this thread, gab13by13 Feb 17 #4

I'm firmly in the FIGHT NOW group. n/t PatrickforB Feb 17 #34

Same here. And I'm highly suspect of the motives of anyone demanding we do otherwise. FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #67

Careful! Floyd R. Turbo Feb 17 #5

Yep. And that's the problem. This has nothing to do with criticizing Democrats. It has to do with looking at Scrivener7 Feb 17 #8

Jason Crow backs up your thread, gab13by13 Feb 17 #19

I'm with you right up until the part about nominating a republican. But I get your point. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #22

Miles Taylor has no political experience and we know karynnj Feb 17 #38

Not fair comparing Miles Taylor with Liz Cheney, gab13by13 Feb 17 #57

I will listen to him but just based on what you said MadameButterfly Feb 17 #63

I remember all the support here for Michael Avenatti for a presidential run. MichMan Feb 17 #64

That doesn't mean we shouldn't want fighters, FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #68

I remember it and thinking it beyond stupid karynnj Feb 17 #74

While I'm grateful to Conservatives who have drawn a line and chosen to MadameButterfly Feb 17 #62

nominating a REPUKE? Skittles Wednesday #217

If we don't look at the issues of the Dem structure, and question it, then we are in a cult... yellow dahlia Feb 17 #81

If you look at my sig line JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #10

They want all poor people dead, depopulation is a part of Project 2025. gab13by13 Feb 17 #20

"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever Ping Tung Feb 17 #11

"I am a Christian and a Democrat. That's all": FDR, when asked to define his political philosophy. lapucelle Feb 17 #21

That was his choice. That's what democracy is supposed to be about...choice. Ping Tung Feb 17 #26

Yes, folks choose to vote for Republicans or third-party candidates or to withhold any vote as punishment lapucelle Feb 17 #120

And add mainstream media to that list Just_Vote_Dem Feb 17 #125

Just as there's nothing wrong calling out the politicians who support or vote for Ping Tung Feb 17 #143

Sir, this is a Wendy's Johnny2X2X Feb 17 #12

I'm not talking about ripping on Dems and I'm not talking about anything that violates the TOS. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #13

I'd be willing to bet that the same posters jumping all over you also FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #69

I actually express hatred JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #184

Fire the strategists and consultant class, The party needs to stop making the same mistakes. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #86

YES! The 'strategists' and 'Consultants" don't seem to have Bettie Feb 17 #137

That really is at the base of all of it. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #144

The other thing that would make a HUGE difference Bettie Feb 17 #146

Indeed. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #186

Any time we stop speaking truth, we benefit those who want to hide the truth. hamsterjill Feb 17 #14

Yours is a great post also, gab13by13 Feb 17 #23

Thank you. hamsterjill Feb 17 #24

Agreed! yellow dahlia Feb 17 #87

It's just demographics Sympthsical Feb 17 #15

But at this point, none of us is. I'm that comfortable boomer you describe. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #16

Absolutely Sympthsical Feb 17 #27

Cheerleaders, the party is always right, swarm, posse, toe the line, echo chamber, blind loyalty, marching in lockstep, betsuni Feb 17 #17

And supposedly, MorbidButterflyTat Feb 17 #116

. SunImp Feb 17 #131

Finding out facts instead of leaping to negative conclusions about Democrats is mocked as mindless loyalty. Projection. betsuni Feb 17 #164

We failed to read history, but it's only now that history is understood at all bucolic_frolic Feb 17 #18

Somewhat related to your OP, discussions quickly sink... harumph Feb 17 #25

So much yes to this! All those bad movies about evil conglomerates trying to rule the world? Scrivener7 Feb 17 #29

My daughter quipped the other day - "Who knew the original Superman movie was a road map..." harumph Feb 17 #42

We are at a confluence of all the evil empire "Bond villain" types. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #90

Time for a paradigm shift. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #89

It's a return to 1877 to 1965 JustAnotherGen Wednesday #231

As I have said before: popsdenver Feb 17 #39

Amen, sis! demmiblue Feb 17 #28

I cleared my ignore list a while ago Bettie Feb 17 #142

Trump 2.0 could have been prevented by closing the border and having a normal primary dalton99a Feb 17 #31

Thank you! intheflow Feb 17 #32

I agree popsdenver Feb 17 #43

... SSJVegeta Feb 17 #33

In his diplomatic, inoffensive way, I think President Obama pointed the way Martin Eden Feb 17 #35

I make no bones about it JustAnotherGen Feb 17 #188

DURec leftstreet Feb 17 #37

For example, gab13by13 Feb 17 #41

I think that's a perfect example because it's my opinion that, if Democratic leaders had not gotten so much Scrivener7 Feb 17 #44

Yep, things changed Just_Vote_Dem Feb 17 #46

And it seems like it took a little outrage to convince them of the fact. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #50

That's the problem in a nutshell. AloeVera Feb 17 #102

People are pissed at the wait-and-see say-nothing do-nothing approach. dalton99a Feb 17 #47

We're in a partial shutdown at the moment. lapucelle Feb 17 #113

Eight Democrats voted to end the fillibuster in October, ten in March. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #126

Your vote counts in both instances are off by one. lapucelle Feb 17 #133

So a groundswell of constituent opinion has no effect on your elected officials? Scrivener7 Feb 17 #134

Social media posts and constituent opinion are two very different things. N/T lapucelle Feb 17 #167

i completely agree with you. We should be able to speak freely if it is for constructive reason samsingh Feb 17 #51

That's a good example of a topic we should discuss in detail. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #114

exactly - and given the power trump is wielding samsingh Feb 17 #121

So the lesson, which I hope we have learned, is that we release it all as soon as we are able. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #122

there can be no healing until the crimes are punished samsingh Feb 17 #123

Concise and to the point. Well said. Escurumbele Feb 17 #54

100% Agree, Scrivener 7. If we can't see our own part in something we can't improve... johnnyplankton Feb 17 #55

Everything changes except one thing that was never addressed, and still isn't. usonian Feb 17 #56

It is important to note that WE elected our officials to represent us Grim Chieftain Feb 17 #58

That's why we have primaries SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #60

And if they don't uphold the promises they made in the primaries? Grim Chieftain Feb 17 #70

Really depends on the promises they made SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #76

And it doesn't need to be a fight. I made mistakes in my job. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #79

Agreed. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #95

Wanting to learn from the past & do better in the future... CaptainTruth Feb 17 #59

Good Luck with that here. n/t ihaveaquestion Feb 17 #61

When do we rank-n-file types get to see the Election 2024 Postmortem? Kid Berwyn Feb 17 #72

Spot on! yellow dahlia Feb 17 #96

Yup Joinfortmill Feb 17 #80

This is what those finger-waggers really are FoxNewsSucks Feb 17 #82

I do think the DNC is starting to realize that much of the grass roots is really pissed at the party leadership Bluetus Feb 17 #83

I think recent events have provided us with a pretty extensive list of things we Scrivener7 Feb 17 #85

I have a list. You have a list. The Party does not have a list. Bluetus Feb 17 #105

Without a doubt. And Dems -- all Dems -- should be repeating that list. Bluetus Wednesday #229

Please link to these threads: MorbidButterflyTat Feb 17 #91

There was one in particular this morning that was a good example. I can't link to it. For reasons I will not state. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #107

Milquetoast, strongly worded letters, old guard, status quo, gerontocracy, Vichy Dems, Surrender Dems, betsuni Feb 17 #124

Good post Scrivener7, and a worthwhile question to ask. I feel the biggest mistake we may have made is to underestimate c-rational Feb 17 #101

Definitely. I agree with all of that. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #115

Right? They see us as the enemy Bettie Feb 17 #147

Well said, Scrivener. yellow dahlia Feb 17 #104

This message was self-deleted by its author PeaceWave Feb 17 #106

I see the same cheerleaders on this thread. hamsterjill Feb 17 #108

I hear you. harumph Feb 17 #150

You are absolutely correct! hamsterjill Feb 17 #199

Our role in getting here today Quiet Em Feb 17 #118

Sadly, I think this is true. We have lost so much civil rights ground Scrivener7 Feb 17 #139

I am 59 Bettie Feb 17 #151

The adults gulliver Feb 17 #129

The Democrats I know aren't lazy, neglectful OR self-indulgent. Scrivener7 Feb 17 #135

"Romans and countrymen, lend me your ears?" gulliver Feb 17 #136

Thank you so much Scrivener. KPN Feb 17 #130

Great OP SunImp Feb 17 #138

Thank you for the thread canetoad Feb 17 #141

Loyalty means being willing to examine our own missteps Torchlight Feb 17 #148

It's not possible currently to discuss mistakes and we are doomed to repeat them again. Melon Feb 17 #152

How is it happening in Texas? SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #156

Beto Melon Feb 17 #162

What's he running for? SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #169

See Below Quote Melon Feb 17 #172

So what did Beto SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #173

This thread is all about why we don't do that.... Melon Feb 17 #175

So who should run in Texas? SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #176

This and your gatekeeping is the issue that prevents open discussion and improvement. Melon Feb 17 #177

I'm just trying to understand SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #178

Why? Are you in Texas? Or are you trying to gatekeep? Melon Feb 17 #191

No, but am trying to understand what is going on In Texas. SocialDemocrat61 Feb 17 #196

And I say again...go read the threads on Talarico or Crockett Melon Feb 17 #210

I was asking for your perspective SocialDemocrat61 Wednesday #215

I have a relative running for the Senate, so luckily Scrivener7 Feb 17 #157

It has nothing to do with being loyal. It's about fighting back against (often) unfair and unwarranted criticism. W_HAMILTON Feb 17 #153

Well, "bullshit criticism" is in the eye of the beholder. Orrex Feb 17 #195

I wasn't defending Garland (especially towards the end) nor was I backstabbing Hillary and Kamala. W_HAMILTON Thursday #241

I may be late to this discussion, but I read it early this morning and just now thought I would add my 2cents. Ninga Feb 17 #155

We had the clear advantage in social media Scrivener7 Wednesday #223

We do not need to do this before midterms and publicly oldmanlynn Feb 17 #158

Suicidal has been the lack of transparency and free discussion Melon Feb 17 #161

The right time is always behind closed doors oldmanlynn Wednesday #218

Absolutely agree! And I've noticed another of the cheerleaders' tactics: Orrex Feb 17 #160

That's not an accurate metaphor for your point EdmondDantes_ Feb 17 #187

Thanks, but I know what I've seen, and I'm ready to be judged Orrex Feb 17 #189

No I expressly don't. But you leap to that conclusion EdmondDantes_ Feb 17 #203

Let's just say that the discussion's been going on since before July 21, 2024 Orrex Feb 17 #204

And they feel just as strongly as you do about their name calling being calling it as they see it EdmondDantes_ Feb 17 #205

I've accused you of exactly nothing except joining the conversation late Orrex Feb 17 #206

To quote you EdmondDantes_ Wednesday #220

LOL. No, read it again Orrex Wednesday #226

Sure thing. It's not like you were replying to me or anything EdmondDantes_ Wednesday #228

Bless your heart. Orrex Wednesday #230

The key: 100% confidence one is 100% correct, obviously morally righteously correct. betsuni Wednesday #212

This part: Scrivener7 Wednesday #224

I would remark that biggest reason Dems "lost" Mblaze Feb 17 #168

Sounds like you have a problem with the jury system. LudwigPastorius Feb 17 #171

She just made the argument iemanja Wednesday #214

No. I think the jury system is kind of genius, actually. Scrivener7 Wednesday #225

I choose to belong to the Democratic party Progressive dog Feb 17 #174

I choose to exercise my democratic rights iemanja Wednesday #216

of course you do Progressive dog Wednesday #227

Nether productive or appropriate? iemanja Wednesday #232

Time and place. Zelda_Orchid Feb 17 #182

Based OP. BannonsLiver Feb 17 #185

The number of RECs, replies, and views to this OP shows just how important to the DU community... Ol Janx Spirit Feb 17 #197

I think we all have perspectives and ideas that have value, even if only to further a productive dialectic Ilikepurple Feb 17 #201

Absolutely agree & Thank You for saying it! 👍nt Raine Feb 17 #200

complicit poozwah Wednesday #219

I agree. But using terms like mcar Wednesday #235

Whenever anyone takes such great care to parse language to justify... QueerDuck Thursday #244