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In reply to the discussion: On a Rainy Day [View all]

AloeVera

(4,374 posts)
19. Catch-22, denialism and a few other things...
Mon May 11, 2026, 11:29 PM
10 hrs ago

"...folks who thought voters should blame the Biden administration (and Kamala Harris, the eventual nominee negotiating for a ceasefire in '24) for what Netenyahu eventually did under Trump."

I don't understand this statement. The facts are pretty clear that Netanyahu did not have to wait for Trump to inflict the vast majority of damage to Gaza. By every metric of the death and destruction of war, the first 15 months were the most devastating and grotesque. Perhaps you didn't watch the daily atrocities and didn't see that shredded child hanging by a hook on the wall, and many other hellish scenes, as I did. In any case, facts and figures which I won't recite here prove my point.

And while Kamala said she was working tirelessly for a ceasefire, she also said that her commitment to Israel's security was 'iron-clad and "unshakeable". But voters wanted both a ceasefire and conditioned funding or even an arms embargo and they already figured out Netanyahu was not interested in a ceasefire unless he was pressured or threatened with consequences! I happen to believe that Democrats are smart people - they recognized a Catch-22 and a losing, disappointing strategy when they saw it.

I would not presume to think Democratic voters are so weak-minded that they would be influenced by "demagogues" one way or another. I think Democratic non-voters made up their own minds, based on what they saw with their own eyes - shredded kids and a moral disaster for their party. That would tend to be somewhat demoralizing and suppress voter turn-out.

"....that issue in the election was a deliberately diverting and divisive canard, considering the republican opposition and the abdication of responsibility we've all witnessed from them.:

Opposition to the war and asking your President and then your candidate for conditioned funding or an arms embargo to protect Palestinians from war crimes and slaughter was a distraction and divisive? And it was irrelevant anyway because... it was all the fault of republicans?

I don't know quite the term to describe this line of thinking but denialism or revisionism comes to mind.

In case you're interested, here is a very insightful and fact-filled scholarly article that might disabuse you of these notions. No, it does not present a pretty picture so if you read it, keep an open mind. But it is reality - it's what happened and the sum total of it all was just too demoralizing for a lot of people who never made it to the voting booth.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/waf2.70009

"...Democrats need to remind voters that their energy and efforts aren't mired in the fate of some nation or interest other than the United States and our people."

That's not what voters saw, quite the opposite. It's a bit ironic that you put it that way...

Aside from every other rotten consequence of the disastrous Gaza/Israel foreign policy, it's clear to me that the road to Iran (and don't forget Lebanon!) started in the ruins of Gaza and the unconditional support for Israel. There should be some lessons learned here for the Democratic Party, but that won't happen unless there is open and honest discussion and TAKING RESPONSIBILITY - no denialism or revisionism - whatever it takes to bring back those lost voters and restore faith in what the Democratic Party stands for.

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

On a Rainy Day [View all] H2O Man Saturday OP
Individually Saoirse9 Sunday #1
A number of things. H2O Man Sunday #6
When was Dick Cheney "ushered on stage" to endorse? What event was that? betsuni Sunday #2
Okay. H2O Man Sunday #7
"It is essential that we have a conversation on this complicated issue" Martin Eden Sunday #3
Very good! H2O Man Sunday #8
One Word Martin Eden Sunday #4
it's a hard conversation to have. mopinko Sunday #5
It has been a long while that I have seen so many of Israel's talking points summarized so well and succinctly. AloeVera Sunday #9
It definitely is hard. H2O Man 17 hrs ago #11
i absolutely wish that jews believed in hell, mopinko 16 hrs ago #13
Thank you! H2O Man 15 hrs ago #15
Good OP malaise Sunday #10
Thank you! H2O Man 17 hrs ago #12
interesting bigtree 15 hrs ago #14
Interesting. H2O Man 14 hrs ago #16
I think you can find numerous statements and actions by Sen. Schumer, if you look, that condem every objectional aspect bigtree 12 hrs ago #17
Very good. H2O Man 10 hrs ago #18
Catch-22, denialism and a few other things... AloeVera 10 hrs ago #19
Americans were divided on that conflict bigtree 9 min ago #20
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