Men's Group

lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)

1. There are two feminist schools of thought

Fri Jan 6, 2012, 11:48 AM

Jan 2012

a) "we're about equality.... for me."
b) "we're about advocacy for women."

I find the latter more honest, but it requires a "no" answer to your latter question.

After beating myself up about your first question for a long time, I finally asked myself why I cared, and realized that I probably shouldn't. Like Obama negotiating with congress, I shouldn't propose my starting position in a way that it already represents compromise with the other party.

Women will aggressively advocate for themselves. Men should aggressively advocate for themselves. All is right with the world.

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How do we advance men's liberation without making women feel like their rights are being infringed? [View all] Zalatix Jan 2012 OP

There are two feminist schools of thought lumberjack_jeff Jan 2012 #1

Liberation from what exactly (not sarcastic)? Deep13 Jan 2012 #2

Yes, that. Zalatix Jan 2012 #3

Do you not see those as burdens? Behind the Aegis Jan 2012 #4

Absolutely right. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2012 #5

Sure I do. Deep13 Jan 2012 #7

This is the reason I posted that Tough Guise clip. redqueen Jan 2012 #6

I'm glad you posted here. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #73

Do you remember the Elephant Man rape story which was posted in DU? redqueen Feb 2012 #77

Irrelevant. You stereotyped the whole website. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #78

I didn't stereotype anything. redqueen Feb 2012 #80

How many were unequivocal no votes mistertrickster Feb 2012 #86

Did I not explain clearly enough about being triggered? redqueen Feb 2012 #89

Being "triggered"? mistertrickster Feb 2012 #91

Why do you persist in the spinning? redqueen Feb 2012 #92

You claim that your words don't mean what they mean. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #93

"oddly that kind of PSTD doesn't seem to be on anybody's radar over in the Feminist group." redqueen Feb 2012 #94

Anything which compels you to be what your are not is a burden. bemildred Jan 2012 #14

i really try not to come in this forum, but this post is really about us. seabeyond Jan 2012 #8

+1. nt bemildred Jan 2012 #12

+1 tech_smythe Feb 2012 #50

OMGOD! SHE VIOLATED OUR SAFE SPACE! mistertrickster Feb 2012 #74

"2319! We have a code 2319!" Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #95

grinnin seabeyond Feb 2012 #99

It's one of a long list of skills I have that are completely un-marketable Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #104

lol seabeyond Feb 2012 #100

was i respectful? that is my intent. thank you. i am glad you are fine with you. seabeyond Feb 2012 #98

I believe you. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #101

i am sorry you feel that way. nt seabeyond Feb 2012 #102

I disagree that there is any intrinsic conflict of interest between men and women, bemildred Jan 2012 #9

Actually, I agree with that. nt mistertrickster Feb 2012 #75

Cool. bemildred Feb 2012 #105

As a man, I don't feel alienated when women speak of inequalities they face unless petronius Jan 2012 #10

Well said. nt bemildred Jan 2012 #11

Actually, what happens more often is the reverse Zalatix Jan 2012 #13

Yes and no. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2012 #15

Unfortunately, that happens a lot, even here on DU stevenleser Jan 2012 #27

I think sometimes it's better to just let the axe grinders get whatever it is out of their system. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #28

And may God save the poor SOB who rises to take the bait mistertrickster Feb 2012 #82

Er... You go in, if you must Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #96

Note to self -- you can't get in a bar fight mistertrickster Feb 2012 #97

Phallophobia. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #29

Did you check my responses to that? stevenleser Jan 2012 #30

I did. I haven't had time to read the whole subthread, yet... but as I'm sure you're aware Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #31

Okay, I'm laughing my ass off right now. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #79

What's even worse is when the hosts of the Feminist Group talk about DU mistertrickster Feb 2012 #76

Look, if I personally, literally said, verbatim "no better than anywhere else" redqueen Feb 2012 #81

Wow, your almost apology is almost accepted. nt mistertrickster Feb 2012 #83

Why should I apologize for something that for all I know redqueen Feb 2012 #84

See below-- mistertrickster Feb 2012 #85

You didn't, though. You added your spin. redqueen Feb 2012 #87

Okay, you might be right. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #90

Duct Tape. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #16

Speak of specific issues like custody rights Taverner Jan 2012 #17

I'm not sure men need to be "liberated", but I also don't think we need to apologize for being men. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #18

I think they do. ElboRuum Jan 2012 #19

I agree. I think we're actually saying pretty much the same thing Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #20

My initial reaction was the same as yours. lumberjack_jeff Jan 2012 #22

First off, we need to understand that there are SOME women who will never be happy with men, period. Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #21

It is important for us individually to figure out what we want to be liberated from lumberjack_jeff Jan 2012 #23

the way I read the OP, it was asking in terms of womens' feelings, so that was where I framed it Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #24

It seems to be axiomatic in certain corners of the Blogosphere: The Dude Is Always Wrong™ Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #26

What issue did you have in mind? nt ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #25

Not with bad humor in GD. That doesn't work, I'm certain. MineralMan Jan 2012 #32

That thread wasn't an attack on anyone. Zalatix Jan 2012 #33

And it was hidden by a jury. Simple as that. MineralMan Jan 2012 #34

What attack was made against women? Can you show any? Zalatix Jan 2012 #35

Stereotyping. Very transparent. MineralMan Jan 2012 #36

But what about women did I attack? I was making fun of societal rules. Zalatix Jan 2012 #37

Has there been a scientific study on narcissistic women? MineralMan Jan 2012 #38

All of what I said is true. Every last bit of it. Zalatix Jan 2012 #39

Whatever. MineralMan Jan 2012 #40

If I'm incorrect then find an example of Zalatix Jan 2012 #41

You know, I'm not going to indulge you by doing that. MineralMan Jan 2012 #42

IOW you got nothin'. You claimed I'm wrong but you can't show where. Zalatix Jan 2012 #43

Threre's been a wave of man-bashing threads in GD past couple months Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #45

Hell, we men should be happy we're allowed here! Zalatix Jan 2012 #46

This message was self-deleted by its author tech_smythe Feb 2012 #52

Apparently you can... ElboRuum Jan 2012 #47

The WoT will continue, never you fear. Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #48

Caught in the middle Zalatix Feb 2012 #51

I'm not a joiner, myself Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #53

I never came from any privilege Zalatix Feb 2012 #54

Okay. Historically men have had a lot of advantages. Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #55

And how long do modern men have to pay the price for this? Zalatix Feb 2012 #56

one, which price are you currently being required to pay, and two, that wasn't my suggestion. Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #57

One: Male bashing. Zalatix Feb 2012 #63

Yes they are, check my post below :) snooper2 Feb 2012 #68

yes, there have been studies on narcissistic women snooper2 Feb 2012 #67

hey snooper seabeyond Feb 2012 #69

With the right keywords googles find everything snooper2 Feb 2012 #70

ya know seabeyond Feb 2012 #72

MineralMan, do you have a problem with this? mistertrickster Feb 2012 #88

Do I have a problem with what? MineralMan Feb 2012 #103

Nice dodge. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #106

I think we send our outside linebacker left in a fake-out play to leave the toilet seat up Warren DeMontague Jan 2012 #44

I just want to say, I'm in favor of vaginal satisfaction. Warren DeMontague Feb 2012 #49

Gender and LGBT issues are bourgeois narcissism. mistertrickster Feb 2012 #58

As far as "men's liberation" goes . . . mistertrickster Feb 2012 #59

I've found life much easier since I stopped worrying about what other people think. qb Feb 2012 #60

Now, now. we'll have NONE of that common sense and goldy rule crap here! tech_smythe Feb 2012 #61

+1. bemildred Feb 2012 #65

In my experience Broken_Hero Feb 2012 #62

Listen? I think it's also important to speak. "Women can't hear what men don't say." lumberjack_jeff Feb 2012 #64

I basically agree about everything you have stated. Broken_Hero Feb 2012 #66

My easy answer? mistertrickster Feb 2012 #71